- This topic has 21 replies, 12 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 9 months ago by
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I think that a games education event would be beneficial.
A lot of Irish colleges are offering course in game development now so an event where some of the graduates from these course could talk about their experiences of these course would be interesting.
Some of the topics that could be discussed are:
How the course content matched up to the expectations that the students were given prior to starting the course?
What were the lectures like and how relevant was there industry knowledge to the course?
Did the college have the resources needed for a game development course?
Probably the most important question of all, how successful were you at finding a job in the games industry after completing the course?All of this info would be great for helping potential game development students to pick the course that’s right for them.
For me it would be important that the talks at an event like this be given by past students for the benefit of future students so the colleges shouldn’t have any input. Colleges get to have their open days where they can pimp their wares but an event where students can tell things from their point of view would be great.
Of course any talk on a course or college would need to be given by a group of students who have completed the course rather than one guy with a grudge against the college and the world.Anyway, that’s just my 2 cents.
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Some of the topics that could be discussed are:
How the course content matched up to the expectations that the students were given prior to starting the course?
What were the lectures like and how relevant was there industry knowledge to the course?
Did the college have the resources needed for a game development course?
Probably the most important question of all, how successful were you at finding a job in the games industry after completing the course?[/quote:b88475a6fc]
This would be very good !!
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Interesting no doubt but kind of surprised that non students suggest and back this topic. Going into Lecturing guys?
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Widen to "Education & Games" ?
Maybe dual purpose event by adding show and tells on "Education through use of games", if we have e-learning companies doing some educational games. (Don’t know that we do.) Well Mals Titanic Quarter work might fit there no? -
Going into Lecturing guys?[/quote:46600e149f]
Ah……NO!
It’s just that over the last few years that have been loads of threads started by newbie members looking for advice on game dev courses so an event where they could meet face to face with people in the same boat as them or people who have been there and done that would be worthwhile for the game dev community here as a whole.
Thinking about this some more, if this event proved to be popular it could be run annually in the weeks leading up to the deadline for submitting CAO forms or something like that.
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Widen to "Education & Games" ?
Maybe dual purpose event by adding show and tells on "Education through use of games", if we have e-learning companies doing some educational games. (Don’t know that we do.) Well Mals Titanic Quarter work might fit there no?[/quote:f6ae65bbd3]I think that game dev education and games in education would have very different audiences despite sounding like the same thing.
Game dev education would be aimed at students where as games in education would be aimed mainly at teachers, lecturers and other people who work in education.IIRC some of the colleges here were looking into serious games so it should be possible to find speakers for an event on games in education
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Game dev education would be aimed at students where as games in education would be aimed mainly at teachers, lecturers and other people who work in education.[/quote:bc6860d410]
I think the latter is a very good idea, its so important for colleges to liaise with industry to make sure their courses are relevant.
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While I agree with you Pete, I don’t think thats what the latter option is.
First there’s game dev education, by which I’m guessing the OP meant training students for careers in games development.
Then there’s games in education, which is the use of games in standard education e.g teaching maths or english
Then there’s games education training which is training educators to teach games development.
Regarding liasing with the industry. Yes this is key, but you have to be careful what is considered relevant. This is very much a give a man a fish /teach him to fish type situation.
In an ideal world a course has the resources to provide both aspects of the following examples, but often they won’t and a choice needs to be made.
Give a man a fish (and he eats for a day):
Course spends resources on latest hardware and software, students leave knowing that piece of software.Teach a man to fish (and he eats for a lifetime):
Course spends resources on quality teaching staff and on training them to stay current. Students leave with an understanding of how and why things are done.Giving the fish in a best case scenario results in a graduate that can fill an immediate vacancy. There is no guarantee that they have the expertise to teach themselves in-house tools, or adapt to new software versions. The pressure is on the graduate to find the spare time to learn how to learn. In a worst case scenario (assuming a level of quality for graduates and not a near automatic qualification for showing up) studios that are hiring at the time of graduation happen to be using other software packages or there is a significant upgrade to the software the graduate trained on. The graduate has difficulty with the practical part of the interview and even if they reach a probabtionary stage they face a steep learning curve at a time when they should be demonstrating excellence.
Teaching to fish in a best case scenario results in a graduate that probably faces a tougher interview but can demonstrtae an ability to adapt and learn. Also the more dedicated newly graduated fishermen will have portfolios showing work in several packages that they investigated in their spare time. Understanding the process behind games development also makes it easier for the graduate fisherman to integrate with the team.
Both of these graduates archetypes are extremes, and regardless of the course content a dedicated and hard working student can overcome any perceived shortcomings in a course.
To come back from my nautically themed tangent, I’ll finish with this:
I got into the industry through 2 games dev courses and a lot of hard work and networking. Given the choice of course convenor I would choose (every time) a trained educator specialising in games ed over a games dev turning to education. IMO the most important thing to come out of a games course needs to be an informed graduate with the ability to adapt to a rapidly changing industry.
There are exceptions but I’ll wait for someone to tear holes in this post before I ramble on further :)
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Aphra
I think a "road-show" might be a pretty cool idea. There’s plenty happening around the island so I’m sure there would be interest by all.
Might be a bit of a logistics nightmare, but I’m sure the usual student unions would lend grass-roots support.
I think demonware ran some kind of C++ game programming workshops a few years back which by all accounts were awesome. maybe something like that would be cool?
Jobs opps, and case studies are all well and good, but I know when I was a student guest lectures from practising professionals right from the trenches was the most awesome thing ever.
Brendan.
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Games as Educational Tools is something that interests me. Apple this week are on record saying they think there’s an amazing opportunity for education software on iPhone and iPod touch but the vast majority of software out there is really just a ‘port’ of flashcards or books to the OS. Very few are taking advantage of the operating system and hardware. This would presumably extend to other platforms too. So count that as a vote for "Serious Games" I guess.
As for the Roadshow – I’ll certainly help back some sort of event in Belfast, Derry/Coleraine. I can likely get rooms, provide munchies. I’ll speak to some of the folk if they don’t reply here and see if I can gauge some interest in the North.
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Apple this week are on record saying they think there’s an amazing opportunity for education software on iPhone and iPod touch but the vast majority of software out there is really just a ‘port’ of flashcards or books to the OS. Very few are taking advantage of the operating system and hardware[/quote:5342e57997]
Any idea if they’re talking about educational software in general or just their own platforms?
I think the opportunity for educational software on iPhone etc. will be severely limited by the cost of entry. Schools are still struggling to keep small computer rooms equipped with cheap (or donated) desktops. How many would divert their budget to acquire 15 to 20 iPod touch, plus assumedly a specialised teacher admin model (hardware or software)?
Cimota, I’d suggest starting by reading this report by Futurelab (formerly NESTA – Futurelab) and EA : Teaching with Games: Using commercial off-the-shelf computer games in formal education
There has been a more recent report published in March of this year, but AFAIK it was not produced with direct industry involvement.
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Just to follow up
I think a games dev education event might be useful but I can see lots of issues – timing (before the CAO deadline), location, who speaks, how we choose who speaks etc., the Dare guys used to bus students from all over the country to their launch…we don’t have the resources for that…
ideas for industry events –
The serious games might be one alright but do we have enough people doing stuff or interested in the area?
I have seen some nice student projects using location based technologies but not sure there is much happening at an industry level here…
We could also organise an event around a speaker from the UK…if we could agree on someone who is doing great stuff in one of these areas….(not just our friends!)
Aphra.
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Hi Aphra,
I’ve plenty of experience from Xbox organising things like roadshows and events, so if this is an option (ie going from college to college), I can help.
I’d really like to run an event with some business people from the games industry, half talk, half workshop to help aspiring development teams to understand how they can monetize, market, promote and distribute their games internationally.
From the lectures Ive done, I have gotten the impression that his is kind of completely ignored in many courses, and we could make the stuff (webcasts, otes etc) available online for people in the future to use as reference points.
Also, I think a small – medium scale jobs fair might be a good opportunity, such as an open interview day for the games industry here in ireland. There are companies big and small looking to find people, and having some sort of face to face for networking, demoing and pitches.
Do you think EI or the IDA would be interested in getting involved in something like that?
Just my 2c
Jamie
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I remember Awakenings – it looked very good, I never got to go.
Even before the debate begins – the event must be in Dublin :)
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I guess it wont take much more than beer or nibbles to get kyotokid or myself to an event to speak or particapate :lol:
On a serious note I do think events like this to give students a chance to get honest and realistic answers would be great. I still feel getting into and being successful in the games industry is a hard thing to bullet point. It’s always down to the individual and their skillset with a dash of luck.
Maybe this mixed with a weekend workshop of sorts would be great. Much like what the Massive Black guys at conceptart.org do. Give people/students a chance to gain knowledge from industry folk and maybe learn some tips/tricks/skills.
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it is probably more an EI thing but one would have to be realistic.
Remember ‘Awakenings in Derry/Londonderry’? That took a lot of work by a lot of volunteers and sponsorship and it was only in one place, not a roadshow.
Maybe a jobs fair could be combined with another event/workshop
Aphra.[/quote:57dde7532a]
Something akin to the Games career fair organized during London’s gaming week would probably go down very well.
you would need an area with an auditorium and then an area with Kiosks for each of the companies and colleges to pimp their warez and Vacancies.Coming from a LANing background I’ve always wondered why some kind of an event like this didn’t take place (Large games festival). At the WCG about 2 years ago there was something very similar done but it was less to do with Education and more with the Pro-gaming scene. The set up was perfect though with a large auditorium next door to the LAN event room.
I know that Dr. Stephen Brennan is always looking for ideas for Events to take place in the digital Hub so it might be a good starting point.As regards graduates speaking, would they have to come from the Games courses or would people from Comp Sci suffice?
A large quantity of the courses that are now running in Ireland were only set up in the past few years so there might not be that many who have emerged into the industry…. -
Awakenings – I was there and it was awesome. I’m sure it took a serious amount of work, but it was definitely worth it. Jason Della Rocca was there amongst others and it was awesome.
I’d recommend getting him back if possible: http://www.realitypanic.com/
Roadshow – The more I think about it, the more it would need EI and IDA and whoever else (maybe the county councils) to cough up some sponsorship. It may not need to hit every county, but Dublin, Belfast, Cork and Galway would probably be a good start. That’s pretty much NSEW covered?
As for the content, lectures and guest speakers who are working in the industry (right across the spectrum) simply talking about their background and how they did it would be a good start.
Getting some suits (like Della Rocca) in to talk about the growth, financials and state of the industry would benefit students and decision/policy makers also.
Getting a round up of the Irish endeavours presenting case studies (PlayFirst’s Diner game – case in point) would also be inspirational.
And of course, the meet-and-greet, recruitment sessions.
Intel, Havok, Demonware, Microsoft, Apple, Emergent could all get "the lean" put on them to cough up some prizes or sponsorship.
Podcasts of all the above lectures would also be awesome, so people can tune in and check them out again and again.
As for when, I’d imagine sometime in February 2010, that would give the students their time off before Christmas, come back, do their exams, and then settle down for their final project rushes from Mar->June.
Right. That’s my 3 cents.
Regards,
Brendan. -
It would be nice to get someone non-IGDA related though.
Tbh I would prefer people closer to the dev scene rather than ‘talkers’ (so no Adams, Della Rocca or Perry)
How about someone like Ted Price of Naughty Dog or something?
Just my opinion of course…..
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Kyotokid
I agree with you on that one, having some one from a fairly hard-core "trench" would rule.
I’d also put forward pretty much anyone who worked on "PURE" from Black Rock, as that game rocked (in my opinion).
Or anyone from the Crackdown/APB team at Real Time Worlds would also be awesome.
Its also (relatively) easy to get in touch with these teams through TCE, which I think most people on here use also.
-B.
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What should be the dress code in a official event? Formal or casual?
event venues
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